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Orci & Kurtzman reveal Transformers: Revenge of the Fallen details
Roberto Orci and Alex Kurtzman, who co-wrote the upcoming sequel film Transformers: Revenge of the Fallen, talked with SCI FI Wire exclusively about coming up with the new story, about what robots you might see and about possibly getting Leonard Nimoy to voice a character.
The writers spoke with SCI FI Wire exclusively last week in Los Angeles. Following is an edited version of our interview about Transformers, which opens June 24.
You guys were not originally going to write the sequel. Is that right?
Orci: Correct.
What changed your mind?
Kurtzman: Well, we resisted it for a while, because ... the first movie was so ... tough to find, you know? Everyone always asked us, "Well, what is it? Is it a cartoon?" They just couldn't imagine what it was, and we kind of felt like we were to some degree improvising our way through it. And then we found it, and felt like we had somehow, just couldn't imagine replicating it.
And then when there was this immediate mandate after the movie did well to do another movie, we felt all the same kind of "Wow." We just felt like we got away with robbing a bank, so we probably can't do that twice, you know? And ... we didn't want to throw ourselves [back in].
Whatever we write, we always own and throw so much of ourselves into that we just couldn't get there without believing in the story. And the story was not immediately obvious to us. And ... they really wanted us to do it. And we said, "We just can't do it until we know what this is."
We spent a lot of time thinking about the sequels that we really loved as kids. You know, Aliens and Terminator 2 and Wrath of Khan and Empire Strikes Back and Superman 2. The thing that all of those movies had in common were that they stood on their own as films. If you didn't see the first movie, you could walk into those movies and experience what was wonderful about them. And the main characters were tested in some very fundamental way. And that was kind of the, you know, that's what led us to figuring out what we wanted to do with the sequel.
Orci: Yeah, it was both that and we were afraid we were not going to have literally the time to do it. The [writers'] strike was looming, we were in the middle of [writing] Star Trek, etc. So when they agreed to give us help in the form of Ehren Kruger [The Skeleton Key, The Ring 2], who is fantastic, we realized the three of us really could do it and not just phone it in. That it would be, hopefully, a professionally worthy successor. ...
When you say the central character's put to the test, clearly we're talking about Sam [Shia LaBeouf] here, right?
Orci: And [Optimus] Prime. ...
And you had a mandate to develop a bigger movie?
Kurtzman: That doesn't really mean anything to us, honestly. Like, we always get to the action last. The action is born of whatever challenges your characters are facing. It's sort of like a musical, you know? The old rule about musicals is ... if the song wasn't moving the story forward or you could tell the story without the song, then it's not really a musical. And same goes for action sequences here. So a lot of it was just figuring out where we wanted to pick up with Sam, and once we started figuring out the story, the action sequences really started falling in place quickly.
Orci: The theme started coming out of Sam leaving home, now. It's two years later, he's going to college. ... What are the responsibilities and the cutting off that goes on when you leave home? And that mirrors the fact the Transformers themselves are away from home. And in a new home. And what are your responsibilities as you kind of step out into the world on your own without your support system? ...
It sort of started coming out of that very real place. Again, the first one was about ... [the] child getting his first car and how that leads you to adulthood and sexuality and all these kinds of things. It's a very simple [story]. A lot of people say, "Oh, it's a classic cliche." Well, it's a cliche because we all go through it. And it's the same with ... heading off to college and letting your parents go and becoming the adult and trying to find out who you are and ... what you're going to do with the rest of your life.
Talk about the process of deciding what robots to keep, what robots to add. There are so many of these characters that you have to pick from. How do you winnow them down, how do you add the new ones, integrate them?
Orci: Well, the easier one, obviously, is the fact that we inherit certain ones from the previous movie and from the fact that Prime and Bumblebee are kind of the two front-and-center relationships. ... In terms of villains, it was again going back to all the source material. ... We got a bunch of the comics again, we got a bunch of the old cartoons, and just started looking for kind of the most elemental bad guy that kind of jumped off the material, and we found one in the Fallen.
And you've got to bring Megatron back.
Orci: Exactly. But part of it, too, was because of the oddity of the strike, what happened before the strike is that Alex and I and Ehren wrote up kind of a 20-page treatment of ... kind of, basically, the moves of the movie. And so many of the robots were selected there. But then many of them were also selected during the strike while we couldn't do anything, as a matter of necessity, by Hasbro and by [director] Michael Bay for some of the action sequences. They literally had to start designing somebody. And they were prohibited by the law from calling us and saying, "Who should that other somebody be?" So it was a mixture of the characters that we had in our treatment and some of the characters that were designed specifically for the movie for production.
Jolt? ...
Orci: It's Volt. I've read it as Jolt on the 'net, but as far as we're concerned, it's Volt. ... That's ... electric car. ...
There's some of these things, like, we're still deciding their names. ... There's just a million. What's the name of the gigantic first one that you see? ...
Kurtzman: Wheelbot. ...
Jetfire, RC, Mudflap on the Autobot side?
Orci: Yeah, right. Jetfire was in the treatment. Mudflap might have been one of those in-betweeners. ...
On the Decepticon side, Starscream, Soundwave, the Fallen and then the Constructicons, which are several different ones: Demolisher, Hightower, Long Haul, Mixmaster, Rampage and Scrapper?
Orci: That's them.
So they're all there?
Orci: Yeah.
There's still more, right? I mean, there's others?
Orci: There are. ...
Kurtzman: That's the challenge with these movies in a lot of ways, actually, is ... there's always kind of a mandate to put more and more and more in, but how do you ... distinguish them, and how do they somehow not detract from the overall experience of getting to know the robots?
Orci: Ultimately, too, when you're in an intergalactic war, it's sort of like saying, ... "How many stormtroopers were there in Star Wars?" Well, you know, [George] Lucas went back and digitally added another 300 in every scene. You're not going to get to know them all.
Well, he got around that by making them all the same person.
Orci: That's true. That's true.
You've got a girl robot for the first time, Arcee. Do you ever deal with why she's a girl robot, or is that just one of those things?
Orci: We may still, as we go through and see the final finals, but we've gone back and forth on that. ... Some of the fans debating, "Oh, man, if there's some lame explanation I'm going to hate it" versus "They'd better explain it." So. We'll see how it ends up. We honestly have things in our back pocket; we'll see which one works better.
And you, Bob, were quoted as saying you were trying to get Leonard Nimoy to do the Fallen?
Orci: He originally was the voice in the animated movie, and at one of the conventions, Alex and I actually spoke to him about it, and he's like, "Yeah, I'd be open to that." But it'll be Michael's decision.
Have you talked with Michael about that?
Orci Oh, sure. ... He's like, "Hmm." And we're like, "You know you're cousins, right?" [Nimoy's wife is Michael Bay's cousin.]
There was also some talk about Frank Welker, the original voice of Megatron, and whether he'd actually end up in the movie after all?
Orci: Exactly, and I think they're in the middle of hashing that out. We'll see who we get.
By Farcaper at 8:43 AM ON 03/31/09
Leonard was the voice of Galvatron in the movie. There was no Fallen character in it. And Hugo Weaving was already sign and has confirmed that he is doing the voice for Megatron in this movie.
By Singewulf at 9:42 AM ON 03/31/09
His comment about Welker was referring to the rumor that Bay was thinking about asking him to voice Soundwave, whom he also voiced in the original show/movie.
By sparrrownightmare at 10:41 AM ON 03/31/09
Correct me if I'm wrong, but weren't the Constructicons good guys? I seem to remember that from way back in the 80s.
By ETo at 11:29 AM ON 03/31/09
The Constructicons were Decepticons.
By Jaste at 12:39 PM ON 03/31/09
I think the Autobot versions were the Dinobots.
"Me Grimlock kick Butt!" :D
By EvilKingMacrocranios at 12:39 PM ON 03/31/09
What if Orci confused Nimoy's role as Galvatron in the '86 movie with the Fallen in this movie because the Fallen is actually, like Galvatron, a reborn Megatron? If this was the case then his slip up about Nimoy being the Fallen in the original is actually a major reveal about what happens to Megatron in this movie.
By DEDPOOL3678 at 12:50 PM ON 03/31/09
The Autobot versions of the Constructicons, were the Aerial bots, and they formed Superion. That was the first autobot gestault or combiner.
By G1_Transformers_Fan at 1:07 PM ON 03/31/09
The Constructicons were at one point good guys as referenced in the G1 episode, "The Secret of Omega Supreme," but were corrupted by Megatron's Robosmasher and turned to evil as well as given the ability to merge into Devastator
By The Rake at 2:02 PM ON 03/31/09
This is great info on the film. They really break down a lot of the genres of robots...its taking me back to '87. Good Stuff.
By Tramp at 2:03 PM ON 03/31/09
The Fallen was never a re-built Megatron. The Fallen was one of the Original Thirteen created by Primus, guardina od the universal force of Entropy, who ultimately betrayed the other twelve and joined with Unicron. His first appearance was in the Dreamwave comic mini series, "War Within: Dark Ages".
By wizard7669 at 2:08 PM ON 03/31/09
for Farcaper,Singewulf, and EvilKingMacrocranios:leonard nimoy was the voice of unicron not galvatron....frank welker was still the voice of megatron/galvatron and soundwave and just to let you know i read an interview that they are building these aroung the unicron saga which means they will need leonard to do a voice for this one or the next one.....either the fallen or unicron but i think they should have him do his original casting like they did with peter cullen....and did any of you know that peter cullen did the voice for k.a.r.r. in the original knight rider series and the new show when they rebuilt k.a.r.r.,anyway im getting of point the point is put the original people where they are suppose to be peter cullen-prime welker-soundwave nimoy-unicron.....they cant put welker as megatron/galvatron because hugo weaving is doing that already but you get my point
By nnoed at 2:12 PM ON 03/31/09
Decepticon Combiners were: Devastator (Constructicons), Menasor (Stunticons), Bruticus (Combaticons), Predaking (Predacons), and Abominus (Terrorcons)
Autobot Combiners were: Superion (Aerialbots), Defensor (Protectobots), Computron (Technobots)
By Matt K at 2:14 PM ON 03/31/09
oh man, i really hope they are lying about megatron coming back, hes just gonna clutter the film, they should save his return for the third film and not waste him in this film
By Correction at 2:17 PM ON 03/31/09
At wizard7669: Don't talk what you don't know. Orson Welles was the voice of Unicron in the 1st Transformers movie, not Galvatron. And yes, Leonard Nimoy was indeed the voice of Galvatron. Get your facts straight first before commenting.
By warcam at 2:23 PM ON 03/31/09
To Wizard7669: Leonard Nimoy WAS indeed the voice of Galvatron; Orson Welles voiced Unicron.
By dakroww at 2:50 PM ON 03/31/09
Nimoy voiced Galvatron and Unicron in the movie, because Orson Welles was too ill too finish voicing it. They were already using a synthesizer with Welles voice to make him sound more ominous because his voice was weakened because of being ill...so Nimoy finished up voicing Unicron. They explain this on the DVD I think.
By WarezWolf at 2:59 PM ON 03/31/09
Direct from the IMDB: "Due to their similar deep voices, it was rumoured for years that Nimoy actually recorded the bulk of Orson Welles Unicron dialogue in The Transformers: The Movie (1986). Welles died before the film's release, but voice actress Susan Blu has gone on record saying that Welles recorded all his lines before his death."
By dakroww at 3:09 PM ON 03/31/09
Nimoy did indeed voice some of the dialogue, because Welles voice was not strong enough by the end of filming. It was discussed on the DVD. Welles did finished his dialogue, but some of it came off as too weak..So Nimoy did filler.
Oh by the way Frank Welker supplied the screams of young Nimoy in the search for Spock.
By Rick Astley at 3:17 PM ON 03/31/09
Wow! Best... nerd... fight... ever.
By Jack of the Seven Benign Galaxies at 3:23 PM ON 03/31/09
This doesn't look like it is going to be a good sequel. That is why I like to watch Doctor Who! Who is Doctor Who? Exactly. What do you mean? The Doctor is Who! What? No, Who! You got me all confused! If you watched Doctor Who you wouldn't be confused. Doctor who? Exac... oh never mind. Just take British Airways to England for April 12th, and tune into BBC One around 6pm.
By dakroww at 3:25 PM ON 03/31/09
Hardly.....I just happen too know this fact. I am the furthest from a Fan Boy as they come. I just suck up facts. I separate the things I liked as kid from the world I live in today. I am a knowledge junkie, but fully accept all the changes that come...unlike many...LOL
By i do not want megatron to come back an he is not going to be back at 3:49 PM ON 03/31/09
i do not want megatron to come back an he is not going to be back ok that is it! oh ya megatron is not the fallen
By VectorSigma at 4:26 PM ON 03/31/09
So these are the choads that gave us the first movie? Spectacular, their story was, lets find a big box, that's really a small box, that's light enough to carry, which created all Tranformers, and when we find it, lets take it into a major metropolitan area, putting suvillians at risk, because that's the only place the military could pick it up???? C'MON PEOPLE, the military can be wherever the hell it needs to be. The first movie wasn't writing it was a series of loose interconnects to get us to the next special effect sequence where giant robots comprised mostly of balls of tin foil and other brick brack could fight it out in action sequences where it was often time difficult to figure out what was going on... Writers... Corporate sell outs more like.
By Charles T at 4:42 PM ON 03/31/09
He names one of the constructicons as Rampage, but he was actually one of the Predicons in G1. I, for one, don't mind a little creative leaning here and there. We should all just enjoy this vision for what it is.
By Nick V at 5:55 PM ON 03/31/09
I thought Rampage was just considered a Decepticon in G1. He was one of Soundwave's little buddy cassette tapes. But yeah, he definitely wasn't a Constructicon. I think they are just doing this to help establish a link between Soundwave and the Constructicons in the film. Plus, in every continuity similar names are always given to different looking characters for some reason.
By oldskooltf at 6:34 PM ON 03/31/09
To Nick V: no... you're thinking of Ravage, not Rampage. Ravage was one of Soundwave's cassettes. Rampage was a G1 Predacon (not to be confused with Beast Wars Predacons). The five G1 Predacons together combined to form Predaking. Anyway... no big deal -- good news is that we're getting Ravage in TF:RotF and he's definitely inspired by his G1 character.
By Protoform_X at 6:50 PM ON 03/31/09
Rampage was in a sub-group of the Decepticons called the Predacons. The Soundwave cassette was named Ravage. They have changed the names of a couple of the Constucticons because they already used Bonecrusher and Devastator in the 2007 film which were Constucticon names in the original series in the '80s.
By t_p_us at 10:16 PM ON 03/31/09
Hey . . You don't think that "the Fallen" may also refer to some of the decepticons from the first movie that will come back in other forms? Kind of like the insecticons who were transformed into other characters? I hope they don't take the easy way out of writing The Fallen by re-writing the Transformers Movie from the 80's . .
By eyesthebye at 10:30 PM ON 03/31/09
Why is Megan Fox holding her right boob as she is running with Shia -- is she trying to prevent a wardrobe malfunction??
By jasonthegreat at 2:35 AM ON 04/01/09
Megan better not prevent a wardrobe malfunction...nothin spices up mighty fighting robot action like boobage :)
and damn that capcha
By HazMatMan at 3:44 PM ON 04/01/09
The Fallen was something Dreamwave touched upon before they folded. It wasn't ever established but it seemed he was the merged essense of Prime and Megatron. And that's why the character was so easily hijacked for the movie.
Just sayin'.
By Endersrun at 5:06 PM ON 04/01/09
In the recent IDW ROTF Prequel, it is clear that The Fallen is a seperate character from Megatron (or Gavaltron). In this series, as in the Dreamwave Comics, he seems to be an entity from the past. He is supposed to be one of the original 13 Transformers created to "pilot" Primus to fight Unicron. He is NOT a merging of Prime and Megatron.... I think you are referring to Marvel's Onslaught that merged Prof X and Megatron....
So let's put it to rest. The Fallen is a seperate Character. Bad guy. Really Really bad guy.
By LetsgetPrimal at 7:36 PM ON 04/03/09
Regardless who the director/writers interpretation of the Fallen is, the movie is going to be phe...nom...in...al. And to show how much of nerd I am.....You forgot the Seacons(Piranicus) and Maximals(Magnaboss), the Terrorcons (Abominus) and Multiforce( Landfill)
By G Force at 8:15 PM ON 04/03/09
Im gutted, Hot Rod doesnt even get a mention anywhere! Why is such a main caracter missing from the movies?
By Hellix Thorne at 11:06 AM ON 04/23/09
Hot Rod was only created in the original series for one thing. He was the vehicle (pun intended) devised to give birth to Rodimus Prime, and explain all of Rodimus' character flaws. Having maturity and leadership forced upon him, Rodimus often displayed rash behaviors and made emotional decisions....This was the Hot Rod still in him.
The Fallen came to earth during pre-Egyptian times, was worshiped as a god, hence all of the "burning fire and magma" symbolism connected with him.
New footage shows that Megatron is back, but not sure in what capacity. Some sources say Soundwave is able to bring him back with a temporary power source. Another source says that what is left of the allspark was enough to give him rebirth. And yet another theory is that its all in Sam's head and he dreams it up......that theory is far fetched as Megs has a whole new alt form.
Also seen in footage appears to be Blackout...same scene a Megatron, and sources link Brawl as returning as well (the biig tank from the first movie).
Jetfire is an Eldar Transformer, Walks with a cane, falls apart from time to time, and very very cranky.
Arcee is definitly in it, but Bay has stated numerous times she dies. Chromia, another bike seen in fottage, seems to be the one they focus in instead.
Still no word as to Baricade's fate from the first movie. Last time we saw him he makes a turn off of stage right and never gets seen again....He might be back
Insecticons are in it, but not anything like their g1 counteparts.
And Soundwave is in it as a Satelite....Ravage is one of his minions, kind of like a deep space probe sent to recon things.
Devastaor plays a role, thats another 6 bots, not sure how much time each one is going to get.
By Lewis Nicholson at 1:47 PM ON 06/12/09
who is it fighting with Megatron and Starscream.
Grindor or Blackout?
Please Blackout.
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Lewis Nicholson:
who is it fighting with Megatron and Starscream. Grindor or Blackout? Please Blackout....More »