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Joss Whedon: What it will take for Dollhouse to survive
Joss Whedon, creator of Fox's sci-fi series Dollhouse, told reporters that there is still a chance that Fox will pick the show up for a second season, provided the remaining four episodes do well—especially with a new lead-in, Prison Break, which replaces Terminator: The Sarah Connor Chronicles in the timeslot before, starting April 24.
"The question is, with a different lead-in, will anything change?" Whedon said in a group interview Wednesday in Hollywood before appearing on a Paley Festival panel about the show. "Will Prison Break be a worse match for us because it's such a different show? Or will it be better because more people watch it? Do more people watch it? I don't know what the numbers on Prison Break are. So there are a lot of X factors."
The following Q&A features edited excerpts of Whedon's comments. Dollhouse airs Fridays at 9 p.m. on Fox.
I have all-new questions for you today.
Whedon: Well, good, because I have an all-new personality. Well, I changed my shirt. I know how to bring it. I've learned from the celebrities.
Have you heard anything official from Fox about when you'd hear about cancellation? Or have they told you if you hit a certain ratings number, that would be more favorable to a second season?
Whedon: They haven't said anything about a number, and they haven't said anything about a date. What they have said is "We get it. We get that the numbers are soft, but it's not a Nielsen world. The DVR numbers are good, and the show's getting better, and the demographic is good, and we all have a crush on [star and producer] Eliza [Dushku]." So they're basically fans.
Obviously, there has to be a number we reach that is viable for them economically, or it would be senseless for them, unless they were insane fans like me. But they get it. They get the show, and they get what works. So they're anxious for it to stay at a level where they can justify throwing down some more. Hopefully that'll happen.
Rumor is that Terminator, your lead-in, is essentially canceled. Does that give you any pause?
Whedon: No. I mean, Terminator did very poorly. I don't know why. I love it. That's why I'm not on that side of the fence, because I'm not a marketer. I don't know how these things work. It started strong, and it fell off for some reason. I liked it as a lead-in because, artistically, they were just a nice match. They both had a similar sensibility, and I think Terminator was a really interesting show that really plumbed the depths of its premise really well. So I was happy to be with it. But the fact is it was doing poorly, and we were doing better, but not great. I think, ultimately, nobody blames us. We did build on Terminator and usually on our own half hours most nights. It's anyone's guess at this point.
Did you sense you needed to wrap up the story if the season finale ends up being the series finale?
Whedon: I always have that sense. The trick is to do something that has a sense of closure and only asks questions, which is what we did. It does have a total sense of closure and a ridiculous number of cliffhangers at the same time in its own way, in a way that's very hard to describe. It's not like anything else I've ever done.
If you get a second season, have you already thought of a story arc?
Whedon: Yeah. Not an absolute total arc, but there's a bunch of stuff that we're already chomping at the bit to get to. We feel like this story is just too rich, and we barely scratched the surface. Although, I'll tell you, for the next four episodes, we scratch it really, really hard. It's going to bleed.
What would it take for fans to rally for a season two?
Whedon: I don't think it's a "Save Dollhouse" campaign. Basically, we've got a few more times up at bat. It's going to be up to the fans to be vocal in their own community to make sure people are watching, that we get those DVR numbers, that they don't slip. If they want to cold-call executives, that's good too, I guess. Or Twitter. A lot of people are Twittering. Ultimately, it's just holding the course, because I honestly began to think that we were dead in the water, and the people at Fox made a point of calling me to say, "That's not the case. We're still working it out. We're fans. We want this to work."
By chawoott at 8:57 AM ON 04/17/09
Using "Prison Break" as a lead-in to get viewers? That's crazy. One show has nothing to do with another. "Prison Break" was broken seasons ago and I've not seen it since, but I do watch "Dollhouse."
What causes me to drop a show, lately, is the additional minute. If that additional minute interferes with another show that follows in the next timeslot on another network, the one or the other has to go. And it is usually the one that goes overtime. (I never watch anything 'live,' but tape shows on 2 VCRs, and there's only 8 hours per tape. DVRs haven't proven out to me, so don't yell at me.)
But don't use the lame excuse that someone else's program is going to help yours. That's already admitting defeat.
{charley}
By Marty B. at 9:08 AM ON 04/17/09
Prison Break's still on?
By dakalmog at 10:13 AM ON 04/17/09
Prison Break might be a better option for Dollhouse. A non-genre show is likely to have a wider appear (even if it has dipped in the ratings), which will hopefully feed more viewers to Dollhouse. Doesn't change the fact that it's an awful time slot. It could simply be the death for both shows.
By .. at 10:27 AM ON 04/17/09
"we scratch it really, really hard. It's going to bleed"
By Ashley R. at 10:29 AM ON 04/17/09
I was under the impression that Dollhouse was only doing marginally better than TSCC and I think even TSCC squeaked ahead a few times. I believe it's been the case that TSCC has gone up while Dollhouse has gone down. All the 'cancellation' articles usually put TSCC and Dollhouse together. I would say that both shows are under the same risk. TSCC has one thing going for it and that's a new trilogy.
By Miggs at 10:32 AM ON 04/17/09
Dollhouse's pilot was atrocious, but after that the show has been amazing. Really good story arcs. I hope this gets renewed.
By Zoltan at 11:25 AM ON 04/17/09
Since Fox is watching the DVR numbers, everyone should DVR each weeks show and then play it (with the TV off, even!) every night before they go to bed and again before they go to work each day. Instant ratings jump !!!
By Kevin Murphy at 11:49 AM ON 04/17/09
It's hard to get people to start watching an arc-based show halfway in. If it were easier for the masses to get catch-up episodes at a moment's notice, well maybe. But we aren't there yet.
By RaeG at 11:51 AM ON 04/17/09
I love Dollhouse and really hope Fox gives it a chance. We are only getting a half season as it is.
Currently, aside from Bones and Reaper, it's the only show on Fox that I enjoy. I watch it on Hulu most weeks due to it's timeslot, but I do watch.
Is Fox taking into consideration the views on their website & Hulu? I would hope so. Dollhouse is popular within my age group (35 - 45) and most of my friends watch it online or via DVR.
Anyway, fantastic show, as are all of Joss' creations (yes, I'm a Whedon fan)
Rae
By TDBrown at 12:11 PM ON 04/17/09
If Fox runs the hulu.com commercials featuring Eliza during their broadcasts of DH, new viewers will know where to go to get caught up.
By Danyael at 12:38 PM ON 04/17/09
The only reason TSCC's numbers were good in its first season was because Heroes was on hiatus because of the writers strike.
By Polymer at 1:03 PM ON 04/17/09
When a show is bad, the lead-in is irrelevant. Bad TV is bad TV. I love Whedon's work, except for this putrid excretion.
By jsonn at 1:04 PM ON 04/17/09
the big variable with TSCC and Dollhouse that makes a difference is that the former was the lead-in. Generally, you put new shows after a strong lead-in to try and build an audience (Lost-Life on Mars) but if Dollhouse is at all (not even regularly) beating the lead-ins numbers, that should be considered a good indicator about the potential for that show.
By Tarc at 1:11 PM ON 04/17/09
Dollhouse - post-Fox meddling - is FANTASIC. They'd be crazy to cancel a Whedon show. And I'm not upset about TSSC - I've never been much of a Terminator fan, and the TV series never worked for me (Sorry, Summer Glau!). The new movie also looks incredibly bad, IMHO. I think the Terminator concept needs to go away now.
By Allison from Palmdale at 1:27 PM ON 04/17/09
The way I see it, FOX owes Whedon a renewal! Period.
Dollhouse may not make the fall schedule, but FOX isn't stupid enough to cancel it, AND T:SCC.
And whoever's theorizing Fringe's cancellation? Take that arrow out of your head. It grabs 3 times the viewers as Dollhouse!
By Tom Daylight at 2:18 PM ON 04/17/09
Polymer, have you seen the first six episodes of Buffy? They weren't that great either. Dollhouse is no Firefly but it's really kicked up the pace in the last few episodes. Worth giving another chance if you gave up with episode 5.
By ecgordon at 3:05 PM ON 04/17/09
I may be wrong, but I think that the only DVR numbers that matter are the DVRs in Nielsen households, so until the antiquated system is retired no one who is not a Nielsen subscriber has any influence except as a viewer on Hulu or a purchaser on iTunes. That is where Dollhouse fans should be concentrating their efforts.
By Jesse at 3:37 PM ON 04/17/09
I recently read an article and it said the best way to save your favorite shows is to go to the Network's page (fox.com) and watch the episodes of the shows you want to save, over and over. I stream at least one episode of Dollhouse and one episode of TSCC a day.
By Uber Critic at 6:51 PM ON 04/17/09
Half of the episodes are good, to great, and half, bad, to really poor...and we all know what they are, and so does Joss Whedon. Hopefully Joss will point to the episodes that are the great ones, and center his writing team and directors to focus on repeating that as far as creating a style for the show and locking in quality controls for the series. They have all the right ingredients for a great show, consistently...but are off and on...with the quality of the show. One week you have a great episode, and the next, a very poor one, and that just serves to hurt the program. They have to start turning in whole episode arcs that are good to great, consistently...and that is their challenge, if they truly want the show to survive.
The show should have been launched with Man On The Street...not the pilot episode, which only served to cripple the show, and turn away audiences, not grow the audience, as was intended, and that goes to Joss' ego for not recognizing when his work is bad. The second pilot episode, like the first, should have been scrapped or reworked, period. As well, the concept of the show, should focus on the Dollhouse serving elite political client types--media moguls, politicians, judges, etc., people who the Dollhouse is compromising for blackmail purposes. Imagine if you have a head of state on video tape doing troubling sexual things with a girl like Echo, he/she could be easily blackmailed and forced to change legislation under threat of being outed...and what about a Supreme Court Justice, he/she may be forced to rule in a certain manner, against his/her ethically charged mandate. Or imagine a government appointee, ala the Secretary of Defense, extorted into giving away secret government war plans, or a media mogul forced to cancel a story on illegal government involved drug trade? That is what Dollhouse should be about, and would strengthen the show and make its subject matter more serious, instead of us seeing the rich nerd of the week...hiring a Doll for entertainment and sex? The whole point of the Dollhouse should be to compromise, the elite, heads of institutions, captains of industry, leaders of religious orders...like the Vatican, the heads of grassroots political action groups, militaries, spy agencies, and governments, all in order to blackmail them. They, the clients, think they are buying dates with high class prostitutes...programmed to meet their every fantasy, when they are actually the targets of the operation, unknown to them, until it is much too late. The ultimate result?: Blackmail enough powerful people, in key positions, and you run the world by proxy.
By MattLive at 8:33 PM ON 04/17/09
It's funny how both Dollhouse and Terminator:TSCC have been affected by poor descisions by Fox execs. T:TSCC were affected negatively by poor time slot placement and also Dollhouse. Dollhouse were also affected in story stategy because of execs meddling in setting up the first episode of that show.
I wonder if both shows could've been more succesfull if they were left alone by Fox execs, and placed on different time slots with better/different marketing?
Otherwise I hope now that exec's failures is take into account and that both shows get more leeway when they evaluate the shows ratings.
By Uber Critic at 9:19 PM ON 04/17/09
They really need to program Dollhouse and Terminator: SCC after American Idol and The Simpsons. Why Fox refuses to do that, and even chose instead to program the new Osbournes reality show after American Idol, and not Dollhouse, or Terminator: SCC in that time slot, is puzzling? If you want to build the audience of these shows, and create branding, and cross promotional opportunities for these programs, you have to do that.
Why not have Eliza Dushku announce a contest on Idol...call it Acting Idol...to have an American Idol audience member try-out for a guest role on Dollhouse. That will create a buzz. All American Idol viewers need do is tune in and watch Dollhouse for contest details over the next few weeks. The ratings would immediately go up because of the promotion. It wouldn't be costly, but it could raise the ratings by millions...but Fox, does nothing in that regard...and Joss claims that the execs are fans of the show? Really, who are we kidding here???
By angus63 at 4:14 AM ON 04/18/09
The media universe is changing. But like generals -- always fighting the last war -- networks can't seem to get the message. They are never going to get ER-circa-1995 numbers. Never. Neverever. Give. It. Up.
1. Shows need to become cheaper to produce. Perhaps backloading contracts for the writers and regular actors until the show gets picked for a second and third season would help.
2. NBC Universal (I don't work for them) has an interesting model, with new shows on USA doing well, they are abandoning 5 hours a week to the (relatively) inexpensive Leno. I think they can take the model further, using SyFy, Bravo and USA (and Hulu, too) the way baseball uses the minor leagues. BSG might not have been able to make it to the majors, but maybe a simpler show like Eureka could.
3. Putting quality shows on cable is working (Mad Men, Breaking Bad) and quirky shows (Monk, Psych) work their too. Because a portion of our cable bills pays these networks they don't need the same level of advertising support as a network show. Pushing Daisies probably could have lived at ABC Family. Perhaps TSCC and Dollhouse could live at FX.
4. TSCC was too smart for a network audience, and I'm afraid Dollhouse is too. Buffy wouldn't have made it on network TV if it started in 2008 in the current media climate. Leave the network to Survivor and Idol and (mostly) stand alone shows like CSI and House where the universe lasts for 46 minutes at a time.
By Jesse at 5:16 AM ON 04/18/09
@angus63 Yes! This@ I agree completely with everything you said. Theyre all great ideas and I wish you were a network exec at Fox!
By Anthony at 5:41 PM ON 04/18/09
I guess Joss can forget getting a boost from the Prison Break lead in. It did just as bad in the Dollhouse 9pm slot as Dollhouse does.
By Seasonofpassage at 9:46 PM ON 04/18/09
There's a possibility--that's all it is--that "Prison Break"s numbers yesterday could be seen as possible support for "Dollhouse", if Fox can realize that the low viewership isn't necessarily because of Dollhouse and more because of the timeslot.
By kernel_thai at 3:45 AM ON 04/19/09
I also agree with angu63. Genre shows like T:SCC and Dollhouse have very fluid fans. U could put it on the Food Channel and it would still draw the same numbers. The fans of that type show r DVR savvy and r able to stream shows off the internet. As long as the commercial networks r handcuffed by the Nielson model, shows like Dollhouse and T:SCC r doomed to a quick death. Leave the nets with mass appeal and reality programing and nurture genre type programing in smaller environments where they can flourish.
Tho Im a big Joss Whedon fan, I cant agree with his characterization of T:SCC as a weak lead-in. I dont believe either show is a typical 8:00 fare where lighter entertainment seems much more well received. I think If Dollhouse has been the lead-in the numbers for the two slots would have been the same. The problem with the two shows back to back is they have the same fan base. A lead-in show with a different fan base might have encouraged new fans to at least sample Dollhouse.
Finally, what is up at FOX? Fringe was off for about three months. Bones, was moved from Wed to Thurs, then disappeared, the back to Thur, then was on Wed and Thur last week and is on Mon this week. Thank god for Tivo.
By meanoldmoe at 9:04 AM ON 04/19/09
Let's hope DVD sales are great , it might help convince FOX to keep going with the show.
It helped Family Guy 's revival !!
By Ken from FLIC(K) at 11:15 AM ON 04/19/09
I apologize, but not one has mentioned the possibility of poor acting and sexy gimmick writing as a reason for this show's tentative nature.
I'm a Whedon fan (primarily Browncoat) through and through, and I despise Fox's business tactics and methods, but in cancelling Dollhouse I would not find them wrong.
Dushku is adorable and sexy, but outside of that she hasn't a glimmer of the chops it takes to carry a character of this nature. In addition, she is backed by an atrociously weak ensemble that is pretty, but vapid (sans Boyd, who is the only Atlas carrying this show on his shoulders).
Be mindful of supporting Joss for Joss' sake. This is easily his weakest venture on his resume.
By Uber Critic at 9:11 AM ON 04/20/09
Eliza's acting was wonderful when she played Faith, but something has happened since? Maybe she is not giving her all anymore? Or maybe, Joss Whedon was reluctant to push her to do better when she started dating Fox' 100 million dollar man, Seth McFarlene?
Perhaps Joss was intimidated, by this, the latter, I don't know? But Joss has stated in the past, numerous times, that he has faith, ironically, in Eliza's acting and claimed that she is a special multi-talented person, but when it came to having her execute her abilities on set with regard to Dollhouse, half the time, she doesn't show-up to act? And I have noticed, her acting is usually not very good in bad episodes, but there is a marked improvement in her acting, in the good to great episodes--so this informs me that much of her ability is tied to whether she has a good director, and or, a good script to play off of.
By cc623 at 6:44 PM ON 04/20/09
TSCC is a great show and I tried to "get into "Dollhouse" but,with no avail.It wouldn't bother me one bit if that show was cancelled.TSCC had maybe 1-2 episodes that I didn't care for but,the last few were exceptional and the show needs to continue!!!
By TSCC Fan at 8:38 PM ON 04/23/09
For Whedon to think "Prison Break" is going to help "Dollhouse" is a joke. "Prison Break" was a lead-in for "Terminator The Sarah Connor Chronicles" earlier in the season and the numbers were so bad for "Prison Break" people blamed TSCC. IT WAS THE LEAD-IN SHOW!! If anything, "Prison Break" had no audience what-so-ever to help TSCC build up it's second season on Monday Nights. Last season every article wrote about TSCC stated it was the highest rated show to debut on Fox since House. After the network took it off the air all summer with no reruns until days before the Season Premiere then placed it with "Prison Break" the show tanked. Mid Season move to Friday night "Death Slot" doesn't help a show grow or build an audience to carry over to a new show. Plus the DVD sales for TSCC varies depending on who you ask. The steelbook DVD sold at Best Buy sold out in 2 days in most states. The Fox Network needs to move both shows after "American Idol" or "House" to build the audience up. Both shows are excellent and need to survive for another season.
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TSCC Fan:
For Whedon to think "Prison Break" is going to help "Dollhouse" is a joke. "Prison Break" was a lead-in for "Termi...More »